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Old 11-30-2008, 04:01 AM   #21
pyro*
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Loipooooon. Kanonika afto pairnei wres analyshs alla ntaksei tha ta poume apla.

To vasiko stoixeio pou prepei na exoume ypopsin einai oti o monadikos organismos pou mporei na dhmiourgisei xrhmata apo to tipota einai h kentrikh trapeza.

H kentriki trapeza loipon dhmiourgei lefta, me vash to akatharisto ethniko proion. Afto metrietai me 2 tropous. O enas einai to poso einai to eisodhma olwn mazi, h poso einai ta eksoda tous, pou ypothetika mas vgazoun to idio noumero (praktika oxi). Ta eksoda mias etairias dhladh einai to eisodhma gia kapoies alles, anyway.

Afta ta lefta ta dinei ws daneia stis trapezes (alpha, eurobank, ktl), oi opoies kat'epektash ta daneizoun se idiotes kai epixeirhseis. Afta xrhsimopoiountai eite gia katanalwsh eite gia ependysh. Meta, apo ta kerdh, epistrefoun stis trapezes kai sth synexeia sthn kentrikh.

As poume twra pws kapoios ektos ths oikonomias erxetai sthn xwra mas kai agorazei kati me 100 evrw. Afta ta 100 evrw einai epiprostheta sto eisodhma kapoiou. Otan aftos ta ependysei h ta ksodepsei allou, kataxorountai ws ayksish kai sto eisodhma tou epomenou paralhpth. An valoume mesa to saving, paradeigma 10%, afto paei na pei pws ta idia xrhmata exoune enan pollaplasiasth sthn kataxwrhsh tous ws eisodhma. Afto paei na pei pws to EAP afksanetai dysanaloga me ta pragmatika xrhmata diathesima sth xwra. Ayto eksisoropeitai en merh apo tis eisagwges, pou sthn ousia einai diwksimo xrhmatwn pros ta eksw.

Me thn anaptyksh tou EAP, erxetai kai h ayksish twn timwn, alla epeidh opws eipame den antistoixei se pragmatika xrhmata, to "kalathi ths noikokyras" (ena sygkekrimeno synolo agathwn pou mporeis na agoraseis me 100e px) olo kai mikrainei, ayksanontas th zhthsh gia xrhmata alla kai thn apotamieysh. Ayto paei na pei pws h trapeza prepei na vgalei k alla lefta, ta opoia tha daneistei apo allh trapeza h apo thn kentrikh. Otan omws logw tou idiou provlimatos den yparxei reysto, tote arxizoune kai meionontai ta daneia.

Otan meionontai ta daneia, paei na pei pws oi etairies den exoun reystotita, ara prepei na apolysoun kosmo h na meiwsoun thn paragwgh, h kai ta dyo. Otan o kosmos apolyetai, meionontai ta noikokyria me eisodhma gia ksodema, ara oi agores, kai ksanaxtypaei thn paragwgh san kyklos.

An ayto den stamatisei, odevoume siga siga se great depression, kati pou apofygame me tis "eneseis" refstou apo diafores trapezes kai kyverniseis ana ton kosmo.

Elpizw na sas dinei mia idea gia to pou syndeetai h "pseftikh" me thn pragmatikh oikonomia..

paizoun polla akoma alla den psinomai na grapsw k allo :X

The best thing you can do to help in a crisis is spend as much as possible. ;p
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Old 11-30-2008, 06:12 AM   #22
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Den leei pouthena oti h kathe trapeza tupwnei lefta. Aplws ousiastika ta dhmiourgei ap' th stigmh pou katagrafetai to poso apo to daneio ston logariasmo sou.

Mikres leptomereies mporei ontws na diaferoun apo xwra se xwra, dedomenou oti to binteo estiazei stis HPA, to thema einai an isxuei h ousia, kai gia na eimai eilikrinhs mou fainetai logikotato mexri stigmhs.
Den to exw psaksei idiaitera, alla koitaksa to binteo me polu prosoxh, stamatwntas kathe ligo kai ligaki gia na mhn xanw to nohma. Den uparxei oute mia antifash, kai ta perissotera sumperenontai logika me bash ta arxika stoixeia pou parathetei kai ta opoia einai gnwsta apo istorikhs apopshs

Opws epishs einai gnwsto oti to xrhma pleon DEN paragetai me bash to xruso, auto nomizw den einai kati to opoio krubetai.

Kai se telikh analush h ousia den einai kan an tupwnetai to xrhma etsi h diaforetika, an kathe trapeza exei thn dunatothta na danizei polu perissotera xrhmata apo auta pou exei (to opoio einai sigouro) kai ta opoia upoxreousai na plhrwseis, akomh kai na mhn isxue auto pou leei to binteo, kai pali ousiastika dhmiourgei neo xrhma.

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Originally Posted by pyro* View Post
peripou sto 14'
Leei oti anoigei mia trapeza pou den exei katathetes, kai paei kapoios na parei daneio, kai etsi apla dhmiourgei 10,000 dollaria.

rite
Pou akribws diafwneis me auto, epi ths ousias?
Btw, leei oti exoun katathesei oi ependutes apothema 1111,12 dolaria kanonikou apothematos xrhmatos se metrhta sthn kentrikh trapeza kai h apitoumenh analogia apothematos einai 9:1. Kanei panta mia upothesh gia na to kanei katanohto. H analogia leei pws einai se polles periptwseis diaforetikh.
An thes ksanarikse mia matia se olo auto shmeio me to paradeigma, tha deis oti einai polu logiko.


Edit:
loipon to binteo leei kata gramma:
ιδιωτικά κατασκευασμένη τραπεζική πίστωση μετατρέπεται νόμιμα σε κρατικό νόμισμα, τα δολάρια, τα ευρώ και τις στερλίνες που από συνήθεια σκεφτόμαστε ως χρήμα
....
Σήμερα, τα αποθεματικά των τραπεζών αποτελούνται από δύο πράγματα: την ποσότητα χρήματος, σε μορφή μετρητών, που έχουν εκδοθεί από την κυβέρνηση και η τράπεζα έχει καταθέσει στην κεντρική τράπεζα, συν την ποσότητα του υπάρχοντος χρεωστικού χρήματος που υπάρχει στις τράπεζες ως καταθέσεις."

Milaei gia trapezikh pistwsh (apo tis trapezes) h opoia metatrepetai ustera se xrhma, de leei oti to tupwnoun oi trapezes, alla ti shmasia exei h tupwsh, shmasia exei h praksh ths pistwshs, auth einai ousiastika neo xrhma. As mhn paizoume me tis lekseis.
Kai oi katatheseis xrhmata einai.

Epishs deite kai auto: http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/add_greek.htm
Nomizw oti dieukrinizei ligo kalutera to shmeio gia to opoio milame, alla einai kai genika polu kalo, an kai genika den ekshgei me tosh leptomereia to pws akribws leitourgei to xrhmatiko susthma, kanei wstoso polles epipleon proektaseis.

Last edited by Feanaro; 11-30-2008 at 01:30 PM.
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Old 11-30-2008, 02:34 PM   #23
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Otan lew typwnei ennow dhmiourgei, asxetws an einai se xarti h psifiaka... tespa opws eipa den to eida olo opote den eimai kai poly sigouros anyways
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Old 11-30-2008, 02:41 PM   #24
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Otan lew typwnei ennow dhmiourgei, asxetws an einai se xarti h psifiaka... tespa opws eipa den to eida olo opote den eimai kai poly sigouros anyways

na ton akoute ton pyro* sto d-ree tous ta mathainoun kala!
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Old 11-30-2008, 05:04 PM   #25
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pyro tpt apo iatriki gnwrizoume? filosofia? eisai poly enoxlitikos re paidi m :@

ps.: pali kala pou ekanes k to post k epiasa ta basika. bebaia se exasa kaaaaapou sta misa :/
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Old 11-30-2008, 05:47 PM   #26
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den 3erw ti lete, oi trapezes exoun san skopo tin kerdoforia alla to mono pou pidaei ton meso politi (kai meta gamiete h oikonomia ntomino) einai to ellima egkefalou pou autos exei.

star titloi "TRAPEZIKI KRISI"
mio8ikan kata 75% ta katanalotika daneia kai 85% ta diakopodaneia!

WTF ??? OMOS WTF?????
daneio gia diakopes? nice
daneio gia na "katanaloseis"? nice

an edw stin ellada ta vriskoun skoura , stin ameriki ta amerikanakia pou einai gnosto oti mualo DEN, pws 8a ta vroune??? easy , den kai pali :P

giati an o allos den exei fragka , den katanalonei, pou simenei oti den apoferei kerdi stin eteria pou exei danistei apo tin trapeza ktlp.
pou ola me tin sira tous dixnoun ena pragma.

oti apla one more time, oi upiretes ton sustimaton pidi3an ton "meso" ergazomeno parapanw apo oso eprepe kai kurios oi trapezes. giati oi an8ropoi einai zwa.

kai meta einai 8ema alusidas... giati px , o allos me tin kompina me to petreleo den 8a parei megalo amaxi, giati px otan 8a tou paroun to spiti epidei den mporei na plirosei daneio den 8a parei ama3i ka8olou, meta psofaei i GM, oi ergazomenoi menoun anergoi, prokaloun miosi tou emporiou stin perioxi, o mpakalis den exei leuta kai varaei dialisi, den mporei na apoplirosei to daneio tou ktlp ktlp ktlp.

o kapitalismos vasizete stin ekmetaleusi tis ergasias, me kurio "oplo" to kefalaio. apla to parakanane kai twra 8a paroune ta @@ mas
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Old 11-30-2008, 06:20 PM   #27
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dn katalabainw ti lete. egw na min bgalw pistwtiki omws e ?
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Old 11-30-2008, 06:35 PM   #28
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dn katalabainw ti lete. egw na min bgalw pistwtiki omws e ?
oxi , vgale xreostiki pou na antistixei se kapion logarismo. i pistotiki einai gia "pistosi" me liga logia na sou dinoun leuta otan den exeis me liga logia na pigenei meion.
epikindini kai axristi imho, sto mono pou 8a se odigisei einai se kakodiaxirisi!
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Old 12-01-2008, 12:43 AM   #29
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oxi , vgale xreostiki pou na antistixei se kapion logarismo. i pistotiki einai gia "pistosi" me liga logia na sou dinoun leuta otan den exeis me liga logia na pigenei meion.
epikindini kai axristi imho, sto mono pou 8a se odigisei einai se kakodiaxirisi!
dn einai logikh auth.
mh vgaleis k amaxi gt mporei na trakareis.
h pistwtikh einai ena polu kalo ergaleio otan xereis na th diaxeirhsteis.
etc k alliws vooz dn tha xeis megalo orio atm opote dont worry.
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Old 12-01-2008, 02:52 AM   #30
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dn einai logikh auth.
mh vgaleis k amaxi gt mporei na trakareis.
h pistwtikh einai ena polu kalo ergaleio otan xereis na th diaxeirhsteis.
etc k alliws vooz dn tha xeis megalo orio atm opote dont worry.
agori mou, einai logiki kai einai i diki mou logiki, kai tixenei na exw sunta3iouxous trapezikous patera - 8eia
kai en energia mana - 8eio
kai na akouw gia trapezika 8emata 8elontas kai mi.

an sou periseuoun xrimata apo ton minieo programatismo sou den uparxei logos na exeis pistosi, apla ta afineis ston logariasmo kai exeis leuta otan xreiazese.
an den sou periseuoun pali den uparxei logos. giati tin pistosi pou 8a pareis meta 8a exeis provlima na tin apopliroseis kai i trapeza 8a armegei ton toko ka8e mina kai esu 8a plironeis gamisiatika tsampa.

kai milame gia "liga" xrimata eos 2k nomizw einai oi aples pistotikes?
gia parapanw pername se daneia pou einai alli suzitisi.
to asteio ma tragiko einai oti uparxoune atoma pou pernoun daneia gia na 3oflisoun ta xrei apo tis pistotikes kartes ... ffs.

stin teliki an to doume pio anixta, ka8e trapeziko proion einai ftiagmeno me gnomona to kerdos tis trapezas, pou simenei oti prepei na apofeugete i xrisi tou ektos kai an einai aparetito (px stegastika daneia).
apla den to vlepei o kosmos (giati einai malakes 100%)...
diakopodaneio? eortodaneio? katanalotiko? nai sigoura.

en meri sumfono mazi sou oti mporei na einai xrisimi se orismenes periptoseis, alla DEN 8a protina se KANENAN kai GIA KANENAN LOGO na vgalei pistotiki karta, giati stin teliki esu mporei na eisai ok alla o allos mporei na einai malakas (den anaferome stin voodoo min exoume pare3igiseis) kai na min mporei na diaxiristei ta leuta tou.
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